Sunday, June 25, 2006
Chinesepod.com
What is the biggest mistake that people make in learning a language? Without a doubt, it is learning from non-native speakers. I'm reminded of this because I just signed up for a 7 day free trial of Chinesepod.com. I was very interested to see the dialogues. Looking at the .pdfs, I could see that a lot of the vocabulary in the advanced lessons was new to me and I even looked forward to strengthening my fluency in some of the more basic lessons. Unfortunately, Chinesepod.com isn't just disappointing, it's shocking. First, what does Chinesepod.com do right:
1. They craft interesting dialogues with at least some real world basis.
2. The pdf files provide good support. Not great: they are not accurate transcripts, more of a kind of background material-but since you can replay the dialogue to your heart's content, this is not a problem.
3. Funny, well produced intros.
4. Several of the advanced dialogues feature two real Chinese people who are fluent in Mandarin discussing topics in a very natural real world, non-dumbed down fashion. Invaluable. But the savvy reader has already probably put together the pieces of the big problem with Chinesepod.com:
Unbelievably, most of the dialogues feature heavily accented foreigners interacting with a native speaker!!! Crazy! Objectively speaking, my own Chinese is probably only a handful of grades better than the main character. But the point is that I would never, never, never teach someone else Chinese! Even after another five years learning Chinese, I would never do something like that. This is an unfathomable linguistic malpractice. No wonder then, so many people never manage to speak a foreign language with any fluency. The worst part is that what Chinesepod.com has done is destroy the best advantage of learning from audio and video: the opportunity to learn from a pure source without having your accent, idiom, and stresses tarnished by fellow students.
Once on Peter Hadley-North (author of The Silk Road and ornery bastard)'s email list, someone cheerfully (and stupidly) opined that Da Shan, the famous Canadian foreigner, can speak Chinese better than "99% of the natives." This powerfully stupid sentiment, if really believed, might account for thinking that it is ever a good idea to learn from a foreigner. Let's get it straight. No one can ever speak a second language as well as a native speaker. There are perhaps a few rare geniuses in history of whom this was not true. The Pole Joseph Conrad whose novels are justly in the canon of English literature, the Indian savant who reportedly learned Chinese at age six and in a few months was composing classical Chinese poetry. Unless you've written the great novel in your adopted language, that ain't you. Of course, this should not discourage us from trying to speak a language as well as possible, but it is the height of hubris and poor judgment to teach someone a language that is not your own.
Da Shan, nevertheless, has a great series of VCDs, the collected broadcasts of China's CCTV series Learning Chinese. Da Shan speaks very little and when he does, with effectively no trace of accent. I recommend this series to anyone learning Chinese. The four part set is more than fifty hours of material, comes with a book, and costs about $20 a set. It's great value. And you won't forever damage your speaking ability by using it.
Chinesepod.com has a good idea. And it has an easy fix: just eliminate the foreigners. Why they haven't, I don't know. The idea may be to make the lessons more inviting for beginners. But if so, it's a poisoned chalice. In the future, we may be able to tell Chinesepod.com consumers by their mangled accents. Chinesepod people! That would be a shame. Ditch the foreigners, Chinesepod.com.
1. They craft interesting dialogues with at least some real world basis.
2. The pdf files provide good support. Not great: they are not accurate transcripts, more of a kind of background material-but since you can replay the dialogue to your heart's content, this is not a problem.
3. Funny, well produced intros.
4. Several of the advanced dialogues feature two real Chinese people who are fluent in Mandarin discussing topics in a very natural real world, non-dumbed down fashion. Invaluable. But the savvy reader has already probably put together the pieces of the big problem with Chinesepod.com:
Unbelievably, most of the dialogues feature heavily accented foreigners interacting with a native speaker!!! Crazy! Objectively speaking, my own Chinese is probably only a handful of grades better than the main character. But the point is that I would never, never, never teach someone else Chinese! Even after another five years learning Chinese, I would never do something like that. This is an unfathomable linguistic malpractice. No wonder then, so many people never manage to speak a foreign language with any fluency. The worst part is that what Chinesepod.com has done is destroy the best advantage of learning from audio and video: the opportunity to learn from a pure source without having your accent, idiom, and stresses tarnished by fellow students.
Once on Peter Hadley-North (author of The Silk Road and ornery bastard)'s email list, someone cheerfully (and stupidly) opined that Da Shan, the famous Canadian foreigner, can speak Chinese better than "99% of the natives." This powerfully stupid sentiment, if really believed, might account for thinking that it is ever a good idea to learn from a foreigner. Let's get it straight. No one can ever speak a second language as well as a native speaker. There are perhaps a few rare geniuses in history of whom this was not true. The Pole Joseph Conrad whose novels are justly in the canon of English literature, the Indian savant who reportedly learned Chinese at age six and in a few months was composing classical Chinese poetry. Unless you've written the great novel in your adopted language, that ain't you. Of course, this should not discourage us from trying to speak a language as well as possible, but it is the height of hubris and poor judgment to teach someone a language that is not your own.
Da Shan, nevertheless, has a great series of VCDs, the collected broadcasts of China's CCTV series Learning Chinese. Da Shan speaks very little and when he does, with effectively no trace of accent. I recommend this series to anyone learning Chinese. The four part set is more than fifty hours of material, comes with a book, and costs about $20 a set. It's great value. And you won't forever damage your speaking ability by using it.
Chinesepod.com has a good idea. And it has an easy fix: just eliminate the foreigners. Why they haven't, I don't know. The idea may be to make the lessons more inviting for beginners. But if so, it's a poisoned chalice. In the future, we may be able to tell Chinesepod.com consumers by their mangled accents. Chinesepod people! That would be a shame. Ditch the foreigners, Chinesepod.com.
